Home   Monday Musing   Hot Topic: 5 Reasons NOT to Post Credits!

Hot Topic: 5 Reasons NOT to Post Credits!

Ok, maybe it’s because when I hear “the rules of this hobby” my skin crawls, or I’m just a natural rebel, but when I followed the link to this post from Simple Scrapper’s post today, it really bugged me.  Those of you who’ve spent time with me know how I feel about this already, but I think it’s time I speak out.

For those newbies with us who may not be aware, it is customary – no, often required – that when you post a layout online you post “credits” also.  The post I referred to above suggested that in order to give “proper” credit, you should note the source of everything on your layout down to the “tiniest button”!

Some galleries will only let you post layouts made with products from their site.  Others will require you to credit the designer, but not allow you to mention the site where you purchased the product if it is not their site.

How on earth is a girl to keep track of all these “rules” – and be CREATIVE??

Let’s look at the subject from another perspective, shall we?

Amanda Blue Sky Dress 007 sm_18402976876687449_largeI’m also a seamstress, having spent more hours than I care to remember working in various costume shops and one memorable backpack factory.  I have made my own patterns, and even made all the dresses for my wedding including my own!

Sewers work with many materials: sourced from one retailer, several retailers, or taken from a long-held ‘stash’.  They start with patterns (templates), and make changes small and large to the design or cut.  They use fabrics (papers) with copyrighted prints by name designers, and add trims and fasteners (embellishments).  They’ve formed communities and proudly share photos of their work in galleries (galleries!).

But where are the credits?  Occasionally someone will link to a pattern they found online, or mention a favorite fabric designer.  But I’ve never seen a listing that said:

Fabric: Fabulous Flowers by Sue Ellen Textiles, Thread: by Coats and Clarke’s premium sewer line, Zipper: from YKK home-sew collection, Lace Trim: handmade from GothMom at Etsy, Hook and Eye fastners: Sew-Rite at JoAnn Fabrics, Hem binding tape by Sew-Rite also at JoAnn Fabrics.

It would be laughable.

We purchased those supplies, and the entity that sold them to us understood that we would use them to make something, and call it our own work.  Fabric manufacturers wouldn’t DREAM of requiring people to credit their work when they post to online communities.  Browsing the gallery at JoAnn Fabrics – one of the largest sewing supply retailers in the industry – one is hard pressed to even find a reference to a pattern, unless it’s a post from JoAnn’s staff.  In other words, unless it’s ADVERTISING.

So here’s my question…

When did we decide that it was ok to let the manufacturers of the products we pay for bully us into doing their advertising?

I can see requiring your Creative Team members to post credits – you’re paying them (if only in product) to do so.  But to require – REQUIRE! – your customers to go out of their way to provide free advertising for you?   I’m not buying it.

5 REASONS NOT TO POST CREDITS

  1. It’s a pain in the butt to keep track.  This is clear by the sheer number of different ways people attempt to do this.
  2. It deters people from sharing.  Don’t tell me there haven’t been times you’ve decided not to post a layout somewhere because you didn’t note the credits and can’t remember where you got the supplies.
  3. It discourages newbies – they often find the complicated rules overwhelming and get discouraged from sharing.  These are the people who are the future of our industry, I think discouraging and intimidating them is bad policy for business.
  4. It limits our range.  People choose a site and stick with it because they know the ‘rules’ and don’t have to stress about what they can post.  While this may appear good for business, it’s bad for the industry.  Sites get ‘cliquey’ which puts off newcomers, people aren’t exposed to new ideas and styles and artists, and they actually spend LESS when they’re limited to the same designers over and over.
  5. It stifles the creative process.  People often just scrap from one kit, to make credit-keeping easier.  This results in layouts that are so much less than they could be.  I noticed a while ago that the scrappers I admire the most ALWAYS pull from multiple kits to get just the right piece.

3 REASONS TO POST CREDITS

  1. You found something you really love and just HAVE to share!  It’s wonderful to be able to turn your friends onto a product you love.
  2. You want to promote a particular site or designer – whether it’s to support a friend or you’re being paid as a Creative Team member.
  3. You want to head off questions.  There’s a particularly unique font, element or paper that you know people are going to want to know about.

As a matter of fact, I think that’s where this thing got out of hand.  I think people started posting credits because they realized they were being asked where they got things and thought they’d head off the questions.  Then designers said, “Hey!  I’ll get people to post layouts with my stuff and tell everyone where they got it, and they’ll all flock to my store!”  and Creative Teams were born.  Then sites decided to ‘protect’ their designers and started coming up with more and more restrictive ‘rules’… and here we are.

2 TIMES YOU SHOULD POST CREDITS

  1. When you scraplift or start with a template.  It is assumed the layout design is yours unless you specify otherwise, whereas it is NOT assumed you made the paper or other supplies.  So to avoid claiming credit for someone else’s work, you should always credit a scraplift or template source.
  2. When you made something yourself!  It’s never wrong to toot your own horn.  Be proud of what you’ve learned and inspire another scrapper to try making papers or elements by claiming credit.  Especially if you can link to a tutorial or other source and share the knowledge!

So…? What do you think?  Do you get annoyed by having to post credits?  Do you think it should be part of the purchase contract – that any time you post for public view work made with these items you must credit the designer/store?  Anyone belong to other artistic galleries for other mediums, and what are their crediting requirements?

Tawk amongst yerselfs. I’m gonna get some cawfee.
Jenn

PS – look in our gallery for our posting rules.  You won’t find them.  All I ask is you be kind, be honest, and don’t overload us with ‘advertising’ by CTs.

Other posts you will enjoy:

  1. Don’t miss this! Print sale at ScrappingSimply.com I hope you’ve heard about the sale at Scrappingsimply.com, but did you know you can buy PRINT CREDITS?  That’s right, you don’t have to have your layouts ready to go, you can pay for them now...

 

139 Comments

  • DrGranma

    Thanks for writing this!!! There are times I want to use an element or a paper but am not sure where I got it… it was the right item but I found something else just so I could credit it.

    Right on about templates scraplifts….

    Let’s just say Thanks to all the folks we buy from and enjoy there work by using it.
    .-= DrGranma´s last blog ..I can’t imagine a life without the pleasure of reading. =-.

  • mstalbot1

    I am pretty new to sharing my layouts online, but I wanted to share my opinion too. When I enter a challenge or look in galleries sometomes I love a kit so much that I want it too. It is nice when the credits are there so I don’t have to ask the person where they got it & wait for a response (that might not ever come). But, I have also made layouts that I wanted to share, but couldn’t remember all the stuff I had used so I ended up not sharing it. Some person (I subscribe to their email) is always complaining how no one is perticipating on their site. Maybe it is because the credit thing is so hard. I wish there was a better way!

    • Jenn

      I think there IS a better way – we need to lighten up. All it would take is gallery owners to make a statement something like the following:
      “We love to see your layouts, and hope you will share them with us! If you choose, crediting the designers whose work you used is welcome, though we’d appreciate no links to other sites. If you do not choose to credit, that’s fine too – just keep posting and sharing and commenting so we can all enjoy your creativity!”
      I think a lot of people would feel much less intimidated.

    • Jennifer

      Thats what I was going to say. I think the easier way would be to leave it up to the person who done the layout. That way if they know who made the kit and the kit name they could share but if they dont then they can still post and share their layouts.

  • Jenn

    Thanks to Anne of Alamo, she went and dug up the gallery posting rules at DST – Here’s the rules and her comment:

    “1. We ask that the gallery only be used for digital scrapbook pages or altered items using digital-scrapbook products. Please do not upload product or prize previews.
    2. All uploads must be in jpg or jpeg format, no larger than 600px high and wide and no larger than 150K.
    3. Each user is allowed a maximum of 5 uploads per 24-hour period. This is to prevent flooding the gallery or crashing the server.
    4. Only Featured Designers may post kit previews in the Featured Designer Exclusive Kit subcategory.
    5. Any DST Gold Member may post their layout in the Exclusive Kit Layouts subcategory as long as the majority of the layout is using the Featured Designer’s kit.
    6. For the safety of your children, please consider blurring out any naked tushies that you might scrap.
    7. We encourage you to leave praise for anyone who posts praise to one of your layouts.
    8. Leave as much praise as you can and appreciate all the praise you get!

    No rule there. I believe it is just a kind consideration not a rule but common courtesy that the digi scrappers in their kindness have done. Hip hip hurrah for being kind! I love that people do credit the designers out of kindness, not because the are FORCED too. Gotta love that!”

    So it seems like DST would be a good place to keep your gallery if you are on and off about the crediting. And check your TOUs, so you aren’t violating anything. As we’ve seen here many designers don’t even know what their TOU says about credits, so it might be worth a quick email to your faves!
    .-= Jenn´s last blog ..Scraplift Saturday: Seeing Double? =-.

  • Karin

    You know, I used to be diligent about posting credits, then I got bored with the whole process, especially after I become a CTM. I thought why am I advertising other designers, I paid them, they didn’t pay me. So, at one point, my credits would read:

    Stuff by A, B, C, D, E, (or however many designers I used).
    .-= Karin´s last blog ..Art Journal Caravan =-.

  • PatriciaD

    As a designer I think it’s pretty cool to see my name but you know if someone doesn’t care to I don’t think I want to get my panties in a wad over it…you’re right it can hurt the whole industry to make too many rules about listing every little piece of a kit thats been used…you go girl!!
    .-= PatriciaD´s last blog ..Brush Tips =-.

  • Linda

    First off, let me say that I am one who does leave credits for the items I use in my layouts; but I don’t like being told that I HAVE to.

    When people say that “it’s not that hard to keep track” or something similar, that is YOUR reality. It’s not that hard for you to keep track. But when someone else says “keeping track of my credits makes me feel less creative”, that is THEIR reality. It IS making them less creative and anything you say is going to change that.

    Another thing I don’t understand is why some designers require credits for layouts made with their items but don’t include credits for the CU or public domain items they used to create the kit. They don’t include them because the TOU of the item they bought doesn’t require it. But then you say that if a scrapper doesn’t give credit, she is claiming credit for the designer’s work. Because presumably people who look at the layout will assume she made everything that isn’t credited. Wouldn’t the same apply to designers who create with CU items? Aren’t the customers who buy the kit assuming that the designer made everything herself if the designer doesn’t give credit to the creator? What makes it different than the scrapper who didn’t give credits in the gallery?

  • Shirley

    It’s funny to me that you encourage others to toot their own horn but discourage them to toot the horns of all the designers out their that work so hard to give them the beautiful materials they use. I have never been on a site that REQUIRES you to list your layouts – especially as a newbie. They encourage it only because it helps the designers make a few extra dollars. Despite what anyone thinks the designers do not make a lot of money at all on their creations.

    I have never felt stifled creatively or have I been scolded for failing to credit a button or a flower. And as far as keeping track their are hundreds of tutorials out there that suggest great ways to organize your materials and how to keep up with the materials you use. Maybe you should make a post on that.

    and no I am not a designer.

    • Jenn

      I’ve done posts on that. Like this one: http://scrapkittydesign.com/blog/2008/05/05/quick-tip-tuesday-keeping-it-all-straight/ – of course that was from our old blog, and a couple of years ago, so it is time to revisit it. So I will do that. But Linda said it well:
      just because you don’t find it stifling, doesn’t mean that someone else doesn’t. I’m sure there are things that you find difficult – maybe knitting or dancing – that come very easily to other people. You wouldn’t expect them to tell you that you should just learn to do it!!
      We each have our own ways of being creative – that’s what makes creative endeavors so fun!

      The point is, Shirley, we’ve paid the designers to use these products. To require us to also advertise for them (which you admit it is advertising, as you say it helps them make a few extra dollars) is asking a little much I think. I gladly advertise for designers when I can – I link to new kits all the time on facebook and twitter. I link to blogs and ‘friend’ people. I send links to my friends on IM when I find something cool. I promote a different designer every week at my crop with NO profit to my site at all. Credits are just not something that comes easily for me. So since I’ve already paid, why should I be required to do something additional? I’m glad you like to do that, and I’m sure the designers you promote are glad too! More power to you!

      And yes, I am a designer too.

    • Angel

      I have traditionally scrapped for over 13 years. I love scrapbooking and love computers. I have PSE and all the things I need to digi-scrap but the thought of having to keep track of all of that frightens me. I have downloaded free stuff to play with and experiment. When I finally get some work done that I am comfortable posting I don’t want to have to worry that everybody looking at it is mentally crabbing that I didn’t post credits. It was hard enough to do the page.

  • Shirley

    I see your point and maybe I am looking at it from a sensitive artist’s point of view. When I see something I did I like to see my name attached to it and I like to hear the praises, honestly isn’t that why 90% of most scrappers post their layouts online. When a designer puts their work out and a talented scrapper makes a page with it and it gets flooded with comments I am sure designers get a sense of pride to see their name attached to the work.

    Maybe those that find it hard to keep up with what they use should just compromise and at least credit the artist and not all the kits. I think the online art world has gotten away of courtesy to their fellow artists. If you use something of someone’s it’s just common courtesy to give them a thank you or a shout out – In my opinion.

    As I said I am not a member of any site – that I know of, maybe I am ignoring their rules – that require me to post credits. It is always a suggested courtesy. My CT requirements do ask me to post her credits but I gladly do this because she gives me her products for free.

    Lastly, I don’t really see how dancing and knitting is the same as crediting. Crediting is not really a talent.

    • Julie

      LOL Shirley, crediting may not be a talent, but thinking in an orderly and organized manner is :) What you take for granted as a part of life is not necessarily the case for others (I have an ADHD daughter and I know how hard she works for organization).

      I do think your suggestion of just crediting the designer generally would be a nice meeting point in the middle. I’m just not sure that the “Thou shalt credit all” folks would be satisfied with that.
      .-= Julie´s last blog ..Ah, Time. =-.

  • Shirley

    You are right Julie – I forget that sometimes I am OCD when it comes to the detail stuff like crediting.

    I must be missing out on a lot of galleries – I don’t see the stock photos being scrapped, I don’t see the drama of layouts with no credits.

    • Julie

      But I think that’s exactly Jenn’s point – we don’t see layouts without credits very often either because they’ve more or less been bullied into it (I feel that I was in my early scrapping days) or else they do not participate at all. As a designer, I’d far rather see twenty layouts with a kit of mine that are poorly credited (or not credited at all) than see NO layouts other than those of my CT. And as I see far fewer layouts than I sell kits, I think Jenn’s on to something.

      In the big scheme of things, it isn’t the biggest deal one way or another (there are a few designers at DST that would apparently disagree with me on this point). I think what really IS important is offering the best experience possible to my customers and fellow scrappers.
      .-= Julie´s last blog ..Ah, Time. =-.

  • Crystal (Lukasmummy)

    I’ve always thought credits were more of a courtesy to other scrappers than to the designers. I very much doubt that anyone opens my page to get a closer look at my boys, they want to see the products I have used and usually they want to get a closer look because they want to buy it. How do you buy it without credits? I don’t think it takes a lot of effort to write credits and I always choose to write them, I also choose to include my journalling in the description because I want people to be able to read it. Personally I think the way to make credits a lot less work is to standardize how designers name their files. If I don’t know who made a file I delete it I want my credits to be complete and that’s my personal preference. I quite often go back through my credits to see what I used so I know what to search for to use again. I will admit that I am really disappointed when I look at someone’s layout and they haven’t credited what they have used and it feels wrong to email them and ask. If they are anything like me they wouldn’t remember anyway. I guess I just don’t get why taking a minute or two to write up credits is such a big deal.
    .-= Crystal (Lukasmummy)´s last blog ..Some people take things to a whole new low =-.

    • Jenn

      Very good point about the file naming, Crystal. Problem is sometimes we are limited by the cart software various sites use. As a designer who’s sold at different places, I’ve had different requirements at different sites. I’ve had to rename entire folders of files, or sometimes just the zips. Also, I’ve had lots of complaints about over-long filenames – when you use the DesignerName_KitName_filename format it is too long for some software to handle. It would be nice if we could come to an agreement on how to do this, but I think as long as people use various cart and scrap software, we’re limited.

      why would it feel wrong to email someone to ask where they got something? IRL it’s a compliment to ask someone where they got the dress they’re wearing, so is it a compliment to ask about a paper or element or font! I’m happy to hunt down a credit for someone who asks, as I know there’s a real reason to do so. Please don’t be shy about that :)

    • Jennifer

      I think thats a very good point Crystal! I think it would make things easier too. Too bad, the carts are standing in the way :(

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  • Maya

    I have responded to this with my own blog post. It was just too long for me to post as a comment here.

    http://www.scrapbookgraphics.com/mayasweb/?p=308

    • Jenn

      Thank you for linking it here, you beat me to it! I appreciate you taking the time to craft such a detailed response, I commented in more detail on your post.

  • Jamie

    I read the comments over at DST and boy was my head spinning. I entered the digi designing community about 5 years ago and quit designing about 3 years ago. It was starting to get overflooded then and now it’s just out of control. Also when I was quitting was around the time of Commerical Use products were just starting to really come around. There are many designers who do not follow correct copyright on items used in their kits and I was tired of following the copyright so strickly, doing my research, etc to just see others putting items that were clearly not public domain items or out of copyright in their kits. Anyhow this isn’t about why I left, lol.

    I don’t think it should be required for a customer to credit. A CT member should be required to credit, that is the purpose of that person. If anyone is published for an actual publication (printed magazine, e-magazine, an actual legitimate business) than yes credit should be given. But facebook, galleries, blogs, seriously? I understand crediting if the product was used to create the blog, website, etc, at the bottom or whereever the designer should be credited.

    It is common curtousy to credit if you remember to if you’re a client, but shouldn’t be required for posted personal layouts. It’s nice to say bless you when someone sneezes or hold the door open for someone (I know they are not the same field, but still).

    I think more issues in the digital community should be discussed openly. Applause to all with an open mind and willing to discuss things maturely and rationally. I think in order to keep this community out of the corporation world, more issues need to be discussed and worked out together. Have xxx amount of standard TOU’s and keep this hobby, job, networking, however you categorize it in control of the people who love and enjoy doing it.

    Sorry for the ramble :) Great discussion.

    • Jenn

      Thanks for taking the time to come over from DST and comment! I do wish we could discuss things like this that are important to our industry without getting all snarky and personal. We’re smart people, we can figure this out. I don’t know that we can keep the corporations out of our industry, but we can make our corner of the industry as welcoming and friendly as possible so that we’re more attractive than the corporations who truly only want our money.
      Thanks for contributing to that!

  • Robyn

    I’ve never posted any of my layouts anywhere largely due to the credits thing. I have the TOUs for everything I’ve ever downloaded or purchased, but who has the time to sort through all that?

  • Kim

    I haven’t had time to read through all the comments (wow…there are a lot of them!) but I have to say Amen, Amen, AMEN sister!

    I have never understood the requirement to post credits. I currently have digital products from easily over 100 different designers in my collection. It is IMPOSSIBLE for me to keep up with who does and doesn’t REQUIRE credits. I have been doing it for every layout I post, but it is REALLY a pain! I constantly use multiple designers’ products on a single layout, so it is overwhelming to keep up with everything.

    It is DEFINITLEY cumbersome and a DISCOURAGEMENT to newcomers into this hobby. I hope that designers will keep this in mind when considering their TOU.

  • Jill

    Thank you for this post. I am a one-kit scrapper because of the credits that I need to list out; I’m just too lazy to do it, and besides, if I wanted to be pedantic and nitpicky, I will find a job instead of play with my hobby. Oh well.

  • Carolyn

    I ageee that posting credits has stopped me from posting layouts lots of times. Some designers put their terms in a Word document and it takes my computer a long time to open one so I don’t use their kits on anything I post. It also is hard to post every item you use when using from several kits as I like to do. I do like to see who the designer is on a layout that I really like and would like to purchase the kit. It is true though that you have purchased the kit and should be able to use it. I always would post designer information on any free items I get. Just my 2 cents!

  • Michelle Powell

    I agree with you Jen and have used the ‘sewing’ analogy as well as another for a long time. Can you imagine walking around with a sign on you that said ‘shirt bought at Walmart, made in China, design by a frenchman named “XXX”, jeans made by Levi, material created in Mexico by Juan Martinez, zipper purchased in China and sewed in by Jose.’? I mean come on. If all these manufacturers don’t require it, why should we? Yes, it’s nice to get a little plug now and then, but making someone keep a notebook with tons of scribbles in it as to where you got this kit, who made it, etc ALL the time is crazy! I know I don’t always use just one kit for a layout, so I’d have to keep track of every little item I used and each separate place/designer I got it from, then go in and make sure I got everything written down to give proper credit. What a pain at times!

  • Nani

    I totally agree! I don’t walk around wearing my clothes inside out so people can see the labels! If I buy the best fitting jeans I’ve ever worn, I’ll tell people about it, I’ll blog about it. If I really think it’s above and beyond, I’ll give free advertising for sure! If I’m wearing a blouse and I’m complimented and asked where I got it, if I remember, I’ll certainly tell. (And if it’s a blouse I really like, I WILL remember where I got it)

    The same is true with scrapbook supplies. If it’s an outstanding kit, even if I paid for it, I want to share the joy of finding just a fantastic kit, I’ll advertise for free, put the details in the credits and show off the kit and what I did with it on my blog. I don’t like being told I HAVE to tell what designer “made” the plain red paper I used for my background.

    As a former pro, now hobbyist, designer, credit is nice, but even doing a search, Digitalegacies is often misspelled! The truth is I like seeing layouts done with my kits and templates more than seeing my designer name in print. This is a saturated market. The biggest reason I stopped selling and went back to freebies is that no one makes a lucrative living at scrapbook design and I’d rather my work be downloaded and used than to fight other designers for customers and have my creations never get used. Don’t credit me, just send me a link so I can see what you did.

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  • Stefanie

    I don’t usually provide credit for my scrapbooking kits, however, if I really like the kit, then I may post something online about using the kit and provide a link. If, however, I use something – images or content – that was created by someone else, I try to give credit where credit is due.
    Stefanie´s last [type] ..How to Create a Watermark Effect Using StoryBook Creator Plus

  • amanda

    I couldn’t agree more! This is one of the reasons I recently began designing my own kits. Feel free to download them from my blog for FREE. I don’t care if you credit me or not when you use them for personal use. Feel free to spread the word about my blog to your friends if you like the kits though. :)
    amanda´s last [type] ..Live Love Kit

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